My reply to a reply commenting on sand dunes in the Gobi - an open wager worth 2 pints in UB - some random comments about hotels in UB...
C'om Riccardo, you know those dunes aren't 300m high... 80m is my guess from climbing up them in a few places and from what is written in one of the old 'Mongolian' Mongolia guide books. I believe one of the older english guide books mis-typed this as 800m in one edition and the LP seems to have brought it down to a slightly more reasonable 200m. Would someone please check with a altimeter watch or GPS with barometer next time they are there, I'll buy them a pint in Dave's bar. Riccardo - want to make a bet on greater or less than 300m? I'll put 2 pints in Dave's bar on the dunes not being over 300 m high (vertical distance from the bottom to the top of a single dune with photos of the altimeter readings, first person to prove it only!).
(Some of my pictures of the dunes here)
PS. The Bayangol Hotel used to be around 70USD on a good company rate (2006). The walk-in rate is nearer to 120USD. It's mainly used by large tour groups of large Americans/Europeans, Russian business men and geologists/drillers spending a night in town on a rotation into or out of the country. Not such a good place for independant backpackers although the Taj restaurant gets my vote for a curry in UB (no, Babu doesn't give me a commission). Willie's 'Cassablanca' bar is the place to find the mining industry partaking in a quiet evening beverage... Black-tie and tails only I'm afraid ;-)
Then again there is a lack of decent accom in UB in the 20-80 USD range so if you want more than a backpackers dorm you may have to look at the +100USD options. The Puma Imperial hotel is a more modern alternative to the Bayangol and is in just as good a location near Sukbaatar Square. The Khan Palace hotel is out past the British embassy to the east (~500m past the embo) and is another new building - it's a dollar's taxi ride from Sukhbaatar Sq.
Showing posts with label Mongolia. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Mongolia. Show all posts
Tuesday, January 16, 2007
Mongolia... Cycling tours
The biggest problem in Mongolia for cycling would be a strong and constant headwind...
I've not cycled in Mongolia but I used to cycle a lot and know what difference the wind can make. While driving in Mongolia I've seen poor souls heading on a road with 100km or more to go to the next attraction, zero shelter, and a 30 kmph headwind that will last for days. Absolutly exhausting work.
Remember that the wind in Mongolia mainly blows from the north or the north-west. Take a look at some of those dune-fields on google earth in the west and south of the country to get the general idea... Rarely wind will blow from the south (in my experience, if this happens for a day or two in the Gobi with warmer humid air then you will be in for a big sandstorm on day 3).
The majority of cycle tourists I have seen are riding from UB to Kharkhorin (heading west) or from UB to Moron or Terkiin Tsagan Nuur (north and north west). These guys are definitly doing it the hard way. If you must do a long-leg of just 'getting somewhere' then fly or get a jeep out and ride BACK to UB with the wind behing you. Another wind-assisted ride would be from Bayan Olgii to Altai as winds normally blow down the valley of the lakes.
One thing to be aware of (ignoring the fact that even the Mongolian Government accepts that MIAT's internal flights are not up to par on safety) is that internal flights only let you take 20kg of baggage on-board. I be very surprised if they gave you an extra allowance for a bike as 'sporting equipment'...
I've not cycled in Mongolia but I used to cycle a lot and know what difference the wind can make. While driving in Mongolia I've seen poor souls heading on a road with 100km or more to go to the next attraction, zero shelter, and a 30 kmph headwind that will last for days. Absolutly exhausting work.
Remember that the wind in Mongolia mainly blows from the north or the north-west. Take a look at some of those dune-fields on google earth in the west and south of the country to get the general idea... Rarely wind will blow from the south (in my experience, if this happens for a day or two in the Gobi with warmer humid air then you will be in for a big sandstorm on day 3).
The majority of cycle tourists I have seen are riding from UB to Kharkhorin (heading west) or from UB to Moron or Terkiin Tsagan Nuur (north and north west). These guys are definitly doing it the hard way. If you must do a long-leg of just 'getting somewhere' then fly or get a jeep out and ride BACK to UB with the wind behing you. Another wind-assisted ride would be from Bayan Olgii to Altai as winds normally blow down the valley of the lakes.
One thing to be aware of (ignoring the fact that even the Mongolian Government accepts that MIAT's internal flights are not up to par on safety) is that internal flights only let you take 20kg of baggage on-board. I be very surprised if they gave you an extra allowance for a bike as 'sporting equipment'...
Mongolia... Vaccinations
Again, relating to a recent post on Lonely Planet's Thorn Tree message site about what vaccinations should be considered for Mongolia...
The main thing to realise re heath in Mongolia is that if something does happen you may be a long time away from good medical-aid or health care. Vaccination for some things may make the difference by giving you a few extra days to get back to UB or on to Beijing/Hong Kong etc for a real emergency.
Plague - rare in Mongolia. Anthrax is more common (that should stop a lot of people!). Neither is common enough to worry about.
Tetanus - get a booster if you haven't had one in the last 10 years, helps prevent infection in the event of an accident which gets dirt into the body.
Hep A - is spread via saliva so worth getting jabbed for if into communal eating/cooking/snogging. Not worth it for a short trip unless you are especially into these things!
Heb B - is spread mainly via blood so it's better to take the precautions (condoms, surgical gloves in your first-aid kit) than to get the jabs.
TB - spread via milk products and also close confinement to carriers (who may have no symptoms). Personally I'd recommend this if in Mongolia for a long time and eating/drinking a lot of dairy in the countryside or traveling on packed busses a lot. Infection rates apparently go up in winter.
Rabies - your choice. If bitten by a animal in Mongolia you should consider it rabid, as in a lot of the developing world. What you should do is capture the animal and it will be tested for rabies - this is commonly not possible so you have the choice of getting treatment or risking it. If you have the rabies pre-vaccination you will normally just need a booster if bitten. If you don't have the pre-vax you will need a much harsher course of injections that should really only be administered with an anti-toxin (available at major hospitals - ie not in the Mongolian countryside and possibly not even in UB). The pre-rabies vaccine is (or used to be - vaccines are changing all the time) a course of shots spread over weeks/months so you need to arrange it well in advance of travel. Personally I'd arrange the pre-vax jabs if you are a frequent traveler to developing countries, not just for Mongolia. BTW, if you are bitten by a rabid animal the first-aid is to wash the wound as soon as possible in alcohol (>70% if available). You can pick up small (10 ml?) blue bottles of medical alcohol at most pharmacists in UB and health clinics in regional towns/cities. Put a few in your first-aid kit.
Influenza - shots are hard to get in Mongolia as there is a big demand for them every winter. If old, seriously young or 'at risk' get a shot before you come.
Jumblina's point about carring antibiotics - some antibiotics can be useful for several things but to treat a specific virus a doctor needs to identify what the problem is and what drug best treats it. Resistance to antibiotics is on the rise and some local strains of virus in Mongolia have become drug resistant. Your doctor in Europe/N Ameraca etc may not be the best person to supply you with antibiotics and you probably won't be the best person to carry out a diagnosis and choose treatment. That said carrying something like doxycycline, which has a lot of different uses, could mean you have a 'quality product' available if the doc tells you to take it rather than getting a possibly suspect version.
I've never had a bad experience from countryside milk in Mongolia though visiting friends with guts not attuned to Asia have had interesting experiences (inversly I get one or two close calls everytime I visit Europe or North America these days). I also use the tap water in UB when brusing my teeth or when I've run out of bottled water at 3 in the morning. It tastes crap but is so heavily chlorinated it should be fairly safe.
T
PS - Not a doctor but 12 years of catching things in developing countries has taught me a lot. Better always to learn by other people's mistakes... ;-)
The main thing to realise re heath in Mongolia is that if something does happen you may be a long time away from good medical-aid or health care. Vaccination for some things may make the difference by giving you a few extra days to get back to UB or on to Beijing/Hong Kong etc for a real emergency.
Plague - rare in Mongolia. Anthrax is more common (that should stop a lot of people!). Neither is common enough to worry about.
Tetanus - get a booster if you haven't had one in the last 10 years, helps prevent infection in the event of an accident which gets dirt into the body.
Hep A - is spread via saliva so worth getting jabbed for if into communal eating/cooking/snogging. Not worth it for a short trip unless you are especially into these things!
Heb B - is spread mainly via blood so it's better to take the precautions (condoms, surgical gloves in your first-aid kit) than to get the jabs.
TB - spread via milk products and also close confinement to carriers (who may have no symptoms). Personally I'd recommend this if in Mongolia for a long time and eating/drinking a lot of dairy in the countryside or traveling on packed busses a lot. Infection rates apparently go up in winter.
Rabies - your choice. If bitten by a animal in Mongolia you should consider it rabid, as in a lot of the developing world. What you should do is capture the animal and it will be tested for rabies - this is commonly not possible so you have the choice of getting treatment or risking it. If you have the rabies pre-vaccination you will normally just need a booster if bitten. If you don't have the pre-vax you will need a much harsher course of injections that should really only be administered with an anti-toxin (available at major hospitals - ie not in the Mongolian countryside and possibly not even in UB). The pre-rabies vaccine is (or used to be - vaccines are changing all the time) a course of shots spread over weeks/months so you need to arrange it well in advance of travel. Personally I'd arrange the pre-vax jabs if you are a frequent traveler to developing countries, not just for Mongolia. BTW, if you are bitten by a rabid animal the first-aid is to wash the wound as soon as possible in alcohol (>70% if available). You can pick up small (10 ml?) blue bottles of medical alcohol at most pharmacists in UB and health clinics in regional towns/cities. Put a few in your first-aid kit.
Influenza - shots are hard to get in Mongolia as there is a big demand for them every winter. If old, seriously young or 'at risk' get a shot before you come.
Jumblina's point about carring antibiotics - some antibiotics can be useful for several things but to treat a specific virus a doctor needs to identify what the problem is and what drug best treats it. Resistance to antibiotics is on the rise and some local strains of virus in Mongolia have become drug resistant. Your doctor in Europe/N Ameraca etc may not be the best person to supply you with antibiotics and you probably won't be the best person to carry out a diagnosis and choose treatment. That said carrying something like doxycycline, which has a lot of different uses, could mean you have a 'quality product' available if the doc tells you to take it rather than getting a possibly suspect version.
I've never had a bad experience from countryside milk in Mongolia though visiting friends with guts not attuned to Asia have had interesting experiences (inversly I get one or two close calls everytime I visit Europe or North America these days). I also use the tap water in UB when brusing my teeth or when I've run out of bottled water at 3 in the morning. It tastes crap but is so heavily chlorinated it should be fairly safe.
T
PS - Not a doctor but 12 years of catching things in developing countries has taught me a lot. Better always to learn by other people's mistakes... ;-)
Mongolia... Rubbish!
The following quotes were posted by someone on Lonely PLanet's Thorn Tree message board relating to camping in Mongolia...
Carry out all non-biodegradable items and deposit them in rubbish bins in the nearest town. Make an effort to carry out rubbish left by others.
and
Never bury your rubbish. Digging disturbs soil and groundcover and encourages soil erosion. Buried rubbish will likely be dug up by animals who may be injured or poisoned by it. It may also take years to decompose.
Sorry, but the LP guide for Mongolia has this wrong, they obviously cut and pasted this section from another country... This is my take on what to do with your rubbish while camping and travelling around remote parts of Mongolia.
If you take your rubbish to a town/city in Mongolia it will get taken out to the town 'tip' and left to blow around the countryside (if it isn't just spread around by local dogs first...). There is almost no proper waste disposal (as Europeans/N Americans would know it) in all of Mongolia, including the main cities and the ger-camps. Smaller cities and towns do not have incinerators or proper land-fill sites and waste is trucked to an area just outside town and dumped on the surface. If you are lucky your ger-camp may have a burning-pit, otherwise they may just take stuff to dump in a out-of-sight creek-bed...
I do the following with rubbish when in the countryside in Mongolia:
Plastic bottles - squash them, store them in a bag and give them to kids in the towns on the main transport routes. They kids will get cash for these from truckers who collect them and take them to a larger city where there are people who buy then, consolidate a truck load and ship them to UB. Eventually they get taken to China for recycling.
Glass bottles - try to take to a city or town and leave them by a bin. Someone will collect them to sell-on to a company who will sell them to a recycler. Your driver will probably know which can and can’t be returned for reuse in UB.
Cans and tins - ditto as for glass but be aware the dogs will rip plastic bags apart to get at food remaining in tins and may cut themselves in the process - stamp tins flat to at least prevent the latter.
Food wastes (left-overs etc) - local dogs will find and eat these if you are within a couple of km of any gers so just leave stuff on the ground surface, away from any well or water and preferably not where someone else may camp. In the really remote areas something will usually eat anything left lying around. Dogs in Mongolia will even eat human excrement - especially that from well-fed traveler's bottom as it is more nutritious than the average food the poor animals get.
Excrement - not withstanding the above point it is better to bury your own poo.
Paper, plastic, anything else - burn it and then bury it. The first stage isn't essential if you are in a high fire-risk area or just don't want to draw attention to yourself.
Tom's guide to burying stuff (2-4 people after a night’s camp...)
-1(thought of last!) – don’t be messy in the first-place. Bag rubbish as it is produced to make it easier to clean up your campsite when you leave. Place bagged rubbish in a vehicle overnight or at least tied somewhere high on the vehicle so dogs visiting in darkness can’t spread it around.
0-find an area not used by anyone as a trail, camping area etc. If you camped in a popular area carry your waste with you and wait until later in the day.
1-find somewhere with a reasonable thickness of soil where erosion won't take place in the near future (not in sand, >200 m from wells and water, not in or near dry stream-beds)
2-use something to remove the top layer of soil (your jeep driver should have (but probably doesn't have) a shovel of some type), put to one side of the planned hole. If there are plants try to take of a 'slice' of top-soil containing the roots.
3-dig a hole at least a foot deep (30cm) putting the soil on the other side of the hole to the first soil taken out - this can be really difficult in hard ground in Mongolia so picking the right place as per step 1 really helps
4-put your rubbish in the hole
5-put the soil from step 3 back into the hole
6-put the soil from step 2 back into the hole - if you took a 'slice' of top-soil put it back the same way up.
If done correctly no-one will notice your pit even if standing right next to it. I’ll probably go down in flames for this from the ‘environmentalists’. Yes, maybe you left some stuff in the ground that will not decompose or may produce minor leachate but these things are only issues where they will significantly effect something, and I’d suggest that this is unlikely from the waste generated by a small group over a day or two. Dispersed and considerate burial is a much better option than taking rubbish to a local town where it will be spread around close to where people are living or dumped to blow around the countryside.
Much more damaging to the environment than burying a small amount of rubbish are drivers who just head across the steppe to see something, chase a fox etc. Wheel marks through vegetation can take years to disappear and encourage other drivers to also start crossing the same area. These wheel marks also trigger erosion much more than digging and filling a small pit (especially as local drivers sometimes like to show-off by heading straight up the steepest slope they can find within sight of your camp...). Make sure your driver doesn't drive around aimlessly and If you see a good campsite 100m from the track then try and get your driver to park-up near the track and carry your sleeping stuff over. If you can't be bothered to do this but get-upset about burying a minor bit of non-degradable rubbish then you are barking up the wrong tree...
Wow, that turned into quite a piece didn’t it! Must be withdrawal due to not writing for a while!
Other stuff I posted in connection with the message on this thread:
re poster#2 - right about tents needing a good flysheet that will cope with strong winds. Most tents available in UB are for 'sheltered campsites only' i.e. a nice pleasant garden back at home. I would take a '3-season' mountain tent as minimum strength due to the wind and the lack of shelter. My tent for the last four years in Mongolia has been a MSR Fury that is supposed to stand alpine storms in exposed sites, I've still been worried at times... Try to move campsites every day (you will if traveling anyway) but if you are staying in the same place a long time then move your tent every 2nd day (actually packing it away will prolong the life of your tent as it won't get damaged by strong UV at mid-day or if a storm comes in while you aren't at the campsite). Camping in prime grazing land is a bad idea due to increased animal poo and flies in the area (goats, cows, camels and horses can also destroy a tent rather amusingly in a matter of minutes).
Jumblina's point about not camping in driver river-beds is very good advice. A thunderstorm 20km away can flood a dry river within 30 minutes. I've seen flash floods totally change apparently small dry river channels in minutes in the Gobi.
Now I await the flaming…
T
Carry out all non-biodegradable items and deposit them in rubbish bins in the nearest town. Make an effort to carry out rubbish left by others.
and
Never bury your rubbish. Digging disturbs soil and groundcover and encourages soil erosion. Buried rubbish will likely be dug up by animals who may be injured or poisoned by it. It may also take years to decompose.
Sorry, but the LP guide for Mongolia has this wrong, they obviously cut and pasted this section from another country... This is my take on what to do with your rubbish while camping and travelling around remote parts of Mongolia.
If you take your rubbish to a town/city in Mongolia it will get taken out to the town 'tip' and left to blow around the countryside (if it isn't just spread around by local dogs first...). There is almost no proper waste disposal (as Europeans/N Americans would know it) in all of Mongolia, including the main cities and the ger-camps. Smaller cities and towns do not have incinerators or proper land-fill sites and waste is trucked to an area just outside town and dumped on the surface. If you are lucky your ger-camp may have a burning-pit, otherwise they may just take stuff to dump in a out-of-sight creek-bed...
I do the following with rubbish when in the countryside in Mongolia:
Plastic bottles - squash them, store them in a bag and give them to kids in the towns on the main transport routes. They kids will get cash for these from truckers who collect them and take them to a larger city where there are people who buy then, consolidate a truck load and ship them to UB. Eventually they get taken to China for recycling.
Glass bottles - try to take to a city or town and leave them by a bin. Someone will collect them to sell-on to a company who will sell them to a recycler. Your driver will probably know which can and can’t be returned for reuse in UB.
Cans and tins - ditto as for glass but be aware the dogs will rip plastic bags apart to get at food remaining in tins and may cut themselves in the process - stamp tins flat to at least prevent the latter.
Food wastes (left-overs etc) - local dogs will find and eat these if you are within a couple of km of any gers so just leave stuff on the ground surface, away from any well or water and preferably not where someone else may camp. In the really remote areas something will usually eat anything left lying around. Dogs in Mongolia will even eat human excrement - especially that from well-fed traveler's bottom as it is more nutritious than the average food the poor animals get.
Excrement - not withstanding the above point it is better to bury your own poo.
Paper, plastic, anything else - burn it and then bury it. The first stage isn't essential if you are in a high fire-risk area or just don't want to draw attention to yourself.
Tom's guide to burying stuff (2-4 people after a night’s camp...)
-1(thought of last!) – don’t be messy in the first-place. Bag rubbish as it is produced to make it easier to clean up your campsite when you leave. Place bagged rubbish in a vehicle overnight or at least tied somewhere high on the vehicle so dogs visiting in darkness can’t spread it around.
0-find an area not used by anyone as a trail, camping area etc. If you camped in a popular area carry your waste with you and wait until later in the day.
1-find somewhere with a reasonable thickness of soil where erosion won't take place in the near future (not in sand, >200 m from wells and water, not in or near dry stream-beds)
2-use something to remove the top layer of soil (your jeep driver should have (but probably doesn't have) a shovel of some type), put to one side of the planned hole. If there are plants try to take of a 'slice' of top-soil containing the roots.
3-dig a hole at least a foot deep (30cm) putting the soil on the other side of the hole to the first soil taken out - this can be really difficult in hard ground in Mongolia so picking the right place as per step 1 really helps
4-put your rubbish in the hole
5-put the soil from step 3 back into the hole
6-put the soil from step 2 back into the hole - if you took a 'slice' of top-soil put it back the same way up.
If done correctly no-one will notice your pit even if standing right next to it. I’ll probably go down in flames for this from the ‘environmentalists’. Yes, maybe you left some stuff in the ground that will not decompose or may produce minor leachate but these things are only issues where they will significantly effect something, and I’d suggest that this is unlikely from the waste generated by a small group over a day or two. Dispersed and considerate burial is a much better option than taking rubbish to a local town where it will be spread around close to where people are living or dumped to blow around the countryside.
Much more damaging to the environment than burying a small amount of rubbish are drivers who just head across the steppe to see something, chase a fox etc. Wheel marks through vegetation can take years to disappear and encourage other drivers to also start crossing the same area. These wheel marks also trigger erosion much more than digging and filling a small pit (especially as local drivers sometimes like to show-off by heading straight up the steepest slope they can find within sight of your camp...). Make sure your driver doesn't drive around aimlessly and If you see a good campsite 100m from the track then try and get your driver to park-up near the track and carry your sleeping stuff over. If you can't be bothered to do this but get-upset about burying a minor bit of non-degradable rubbish then you are barking up the wrong tree...
Wow, that turned into quite a piece didn’t it! Must be withdrawal due to not writing for a while!
Other stuff I posted in connection with the message on this thread:
re poster#2 - right about tents needing a good flysheet that will cope with strong winds. Most tents available in UB are for 'sheltered campsites only' i.e. a nice pleasant garden back at home. I would take a '3-season' mountain tent as minimum strength due to the wind and the lack of shelter. My tent for the last four years in Mongolia has been a MSR Fury that is supposed to stand alpine storms in exposed sites, I've still been worried at times... Try to move campsites every day (you will if traveling anyway) but if you are staying in the same place a long time then move your tent every 2nd day (actually packing it away will prolong the life of your tent as it won't get damaged by strong UV at mid-day or if a storm comes in while you aren't at the campsite). Camping in prime grazing land is a bad idea due to increased animal poo and flies in the area (goats, cows, camels and horses can also destroy a tent rather amusingly in a matter of minutes).
Jumblina's point about not camping in driver river-beds is very good advice. A thunderstorm 20km away can flood a dry river within 30 minutes. I've seen flash floods totally change apparently small dry river channels in minutes in the Gobi.
Now I await the flaming…
T
Tuesday, January 02, 2007
Books about Mongolia
Following on from a thread on another website I've just been thinking about books available as an introduction to Mongolia. There are many out there but the info below links to some of my favourites...
Yep, 'Last Disco' and 'Wild East' are dated, 'Dragon Hunter' is a great book but not really relevant to today - does have some insight into the local character but from a fairly colonial viewpoint.
‘Edge of Blue Heaven’ by Benedict Allen is a good read and has some good pictures, it is about Benedict’s journey by horse, camel and foot around Mongolia. I particularly like his comments about how long a vegetarian would survive on the nomad diet but wouldn’t want to be one of his pack-animals who he seems to have a habit of killing-off… A friend found me a second-hand edition hard-back, don’t know if it’s still available, check amazon.co.uk as it’s a Brit publication.
There is a series of pictorial maps/satellite images published by a N American foundation called Conservation Ink for 4 of the protected areas in Mongolia which are excellent introductions to the localities. You can order them from the foundation for 8 USD each (www.conservationink.org) or you can order them from www.shopmongolia.com for 18 USD each (ho, ho, ho…)
For other insights into the park areas there is a great series of guide books published in association with a German agency www.eco-nature-edition.com. They give very good information on several of the park areas including flora, fauna and issues with integrating nomads and wildlife conservation. They are probably the best thing if you want to know what type of bush you are sheltering from the sun under and the name of the lizard that just scrabbled away in the sand. I seem to remember more guides than are shown on their website, which seems a bit dated. All are available in English, probably German and some have even been translated into Japanese. Fairly easy to pick up in UB when you get to Mongolia.
PS
I just found www.mongoleionline.de - check it out as a great source of Mongolian hard to get books in Europe. I have to order "Imperial Mongolian Cooking" to see if it's for real or not...
Yep, 'Last Disco' and 'Wild East' are dated, 'Dragon Hunter' is a great book but not really relevant to today - does have some insight into the local character but from a fairly colonial viewpoint.
‘Edge of Blue Heaven’ by Benedict Allen is a good read and has some good pictures, it is about Benedict’s journey by horse, camel and foot around Mongolia. I particularly like his comments about how long a vegetarian would survive on the nomad diet but wouldn’t want to be one of his pack-animals who he seems to have a habit of killing-off… A friend found me a second-hand edition hard-back, don’t know if it’s still available, check amazon.co.uk as it’s a Brit publication.
There is a series of pictorial maps/satellite images published by a N American foundation called Conservation Ink for 4 of the protected areas in Mongolia which are excellent introductions to the localities. You can order them from the foundation for 8 USD each (www.conservationink.org) or you can order them from www.shopmongolia.com for 18 USD each (ho, ho, ho…)
For other insights into the park areas there is a great series of guide books published in association with a German agency www.eco-nature-edition.com. They give very good information on several of the park areas including flora, fauna and issues with integrating nomads and wildlife conservation. They are probably the best thing if you want to know what type of bush you are sheltering from the sun under and the name of the lizard that just scrabbled away in the sand. I seem to remember more guides than are shown on their website, which seems a bit dated. All are available in English, probably German and some have even been translated into Japanese. Fairly easy to pick up in UB when you get to Mongolia.
PS
I just found www.mongoleionline.de - check it out as a great source of Mongolian hard to get books in Europe. I have to order "Imperial Mongolian Cooking" to see if it's for real or not...
Wednesday, December 13, 2006
More on traveling through Mongolia and hiring jeeps...
A post I recently put on Lonely Planet's thorn tree branch for Mongolia, the discussion was started by taking about vehicle fuel use...
Hi riccardo,
hadn't seen your reply to the other post - very good info and fairly spot on, looks like we are thinking along the same lines, other than that I love those "worthless, arid, dusty flat and huge place" - there aren't too many of them left in the world that you can drive across like in the Gobi...
You were very lucky getting away uninjured if your jeep rolled. Driving if the biggest safety issue in Mongolia as medical assistance in the remote areas is absolutely zero. My medical insurance rates Mongolia with the same current risk as for Iraq and Afghanistan… There are only a limited number of helicopters in the country (4 or 5 available as commercial hire) and these are often out on fishing tours in the summer. Even worse is that they have to get permission from a government/military authority before flying - last year my company wanted to arrange a medical evacuation of a driver who had rolled his vehicle and was in a coma, the authority 'decided' a helicopter evacuation wasn't necessary and wouldn't give the pilots permission to fly. We had to send a local doctor out to the countryside and the casualty was brought to UB a few days later, where he eventually died.
Even if you can get permission for a helicopter evacuation (and your health insurance will pay the cost, currently around 2200 USD per hour's flight time) it takes a helicopter about 2.5 hours to get from UB to near Yolyn Am and another 2.5 hrs to get back to UB (so over 10,000 USD), where medical facilities are still fairly poor and you’ll probably just be stabalised before needing a international medivac to Beijing or further. Basically, if you are in a critical condition in a remote part of Mongolia (say an open fracture of the femur or anything else that causes a huge blood loss and shock) YOU WILL PROBABLY DIE - no questions asked, do not pass go, do not collect 200 quid
I personally know of two other vehicle rolls last year where people died. In one, the foreign passenger was sleeping when the vehicle rolled and woke up next to his dead driver. Another vehicle roll killed 5 local guys from a mining company in a single accident.
I think anyone planning a long jeep or van journey around Mongolia should add on a week at the start of their trip to find a good driver and jeep. Do some day trips out from UB to Terelj or Khustai as a test run to see if you get along with the driver, his driving is safe and his vehicle doesn’t break down all the time. The time you spend doing this will make a huge difference to the enjoyment of a 2-week trip and possibly to your health for years to come.
Moving on… General advice for ‘independent’ travellers in Mongolia…
People who suggest that tourist should not worry about things like over-reporting fuel use or paying for drivers ‘accommodation’ when they sleep in the back of the van anyway are not helping the areas they visit. Mongolian was a closed county 15 years ago and people are still learning how to deal with an open society and an open-market economy. Not all tourist companies have experience or knowledge of the world outside Mongolia (say, how a backpacker hostel should be run) and many are learning what they can ‘get away with’ as they go along. Same with the drivers, where siphoning off a bit of petrol every now and then is a rite handed down from father to son…
How do people think they are helping when they accept being ripped-off because ‘the people are so poor’ anyway? This encourages tour companies and drivers to lie, steal and cheat rather than provide a good service. If you do get good service then make sure it is rewarded somehow – possibly not via cash but with something useful (do you really need to carry that sleeping bag back to Europe/N America? How about giving it to the driver who drove you safely, at a reasonable pace, for the last one or two weeks? And tell him why you are giving it to him.)
Staying at local gers is another delicate issue. If your driver rolls up to a ger and lets you know that you will be spending the night there and it will cost 5USD then he has probably been there before, knows the family, and the family will be used to seeing him with passengers and getting paid for it (probably 2 USD out of the 5 you give the driver). Don’t start feeling sorry for the family and giving out food/money/gifts – they have accepted you as a commercial guest.
If, however, your driver is obviously lost, eventually finds a ger as the sun is setting, goes in, and then comes out saying you can stay for the night, it is probably a family he has never met before and who are not used to ‘paying guests’ – the true hospitable nomad… Be very suspicious if the driver then says ‘5 USD per person’ and wants to collect it from you to give to the family. Make sure you pass the money over yourself. Also consider cooking your own food (and offering to share it with the family). If the ger is in a really remote area then a gift such as a kilo of flower, a bag of salt or sugar will probably be appreciated. Other good gifts are pencils and note-books for children. Please don’t give out batteries as some guide-books suggest – they only end up being thrown out when they are dead.
Whoa, that went on for a little longer than expected…
Hi riccardo,
hadn't seen your reply to the other post - very good info and fairly spot on, looks like we are thinking along the same lines, other than that I love those "worthless, arid, dusty flat and huge place" - there aren't too many of them left in the world that you can drive across like in the Gobi...
You were very lucky getting away uninjured if your jeep rolled. Driving if the biggest safety issue in Mongolia as medical assistance in the remote areas is absolutely zero. My medical insurance rates Mongolia with the same current risk as for Iraq and Afghanistan… There are only a limited number of helicopters in the country (4 or 5 available as commercial hire) and these are often out on fishing tours in the summer. Even worse is that they have to get permission from a government/military authority before flying - last year my company wanted to arrange a medical evacuation of a driver who had rolled his vehicle and was in a coma, the authority 'decided' a helicopter evacuation wasn't necessary and wouldn't give the pilots permission to fly. We had to send a local doctor out to the countryside and the casualty was brought to UB a few days later, where he eventually died.
Even if you can get permission for a helicopter evacuation (and your health insurance will pay the cost, currently around 2200 USD per hour's flight time) it takes a helicopter about 2.5 hours to get from UB to near Yolyn Am and another 2.5 hrs to get back to UB (so over 10,000 USD), where medical facilities are still fairly poor and you’ll probably just be stabalised before needing a international medivac to Beijing or further. Basically, if you are in a critical condition in a remote part of Mongolia (say an open fracture of the femur or anything else that causes a huge blood loss and shock) YOU WILL PROBABLY DIE - no questions asked, do not pass go, do not collect 200 quid
I personally know of two other vehicle rolls last year where people died. In one, the foreign passenger was sleeping when the vehicle rolled and woke up next to his dead driver. Another vehicle roll killed 5 local guys from a mining company in a single accident.
I think anyone planning a long jeep or van journey around Mongolia should add on a week at the start of their trip to find a good driver and jeep. Do some day trips out from UB to Terelj or Khustai as a test run to see if you get along with the driver, his driving is safe and his vehicle doesn’t break down all the time. The time you spend doing this will make a huge difference to the enjoyment of a 2-week trip and possibly to your health for years to come.
Moving on… General advice for ‘independent’ travellers in Mongolia…
People who suggest that tourist should not worry about things like over-reporting fuel use or paying for drivers ‘accommodation’ when they sleep in the back of the van anyway are not helping the areas they visit. Mongolian was a closed county 15 years ago and people are still learning how to deal with an open society and an open-market economy. Not all tourist companies have experience or knowledge of the world outside Mongolia (say, how a backpacker hostel should be run) and many are learning what they can ‘get away with’ as they go along. Same with the drivers, where siphoning off a bit of petrol every now and then is a rite handed down from father to son…
How do people think they are helping when they accept being ripped-off because ‘the people are so poor’ anyway? This encourages tour companies and drivers to lie, steal and cheat rather than provide a good service. If you do get good service then make sure it is rewarded somehow – possibly not via cash but with something useful (do you really need to carry that sleeping bag back to Europe/N America? How about giving it to the driver who drove you safely, at a reasonable pace, for the last one or two weeks? And tell him why you are giving it to him.)
Staying at local gers is another delicate issue. If your driver rolls up to a ger and lets you know that you will be spending the night there and it will cost 5USD then he has probably been there before, knows the family, and the family will be used to seeing him with passengers and getting paid for it (probably 2 USD out of the 5 you give the driver). Don’t start feeling sorry for the family and giving out food/money/gifts – they have accepted you as a commercial guest.
If, however, your driver is obviously lost, eventually finds a ger as the sun is setting, goes in, and then comes out saying you can stay for the night, it is probably a family he has never met before and who are not used to ‘paying guests’ – the true hospitable nomad… Be very suspicious if the driver then says ‘5 USD per person’ and wants to collect it from you to give to the family. Make sure you pass the money over yourself. Also consider cooking your own food (and offering to share it with the family). If the ger is in a really remote area then a gift such as a kilo of flower, a bag of salt or sugar will probably be appreciated. Other good gifts are pencils and note-books for children. Please don’t give out batteries as some guide-books suggest – they only end up being thrown out when they are dead.
Whoa, that went on for a little longer than expected…
Monday, December 04, 2006
Only in Mongolia - State Sponsored Terrorism
Unbelievable but true...
A MIAT flight from Dalanzadgad to UB was apparently held up by 2 passengers who pulled out pistols upon landing at UB airport last week. Some people were tied up but it all ended peacefully, the only casualties being a lady who received cuts on her face and lips and one person who was taken to hospital due to high blood pressure.
Unbeknownst to the passengers or flight crew this was a planned test of counter-terrorism measures with the “hijackers” being members of the Mongolian General Intelligence Agency (GIA). According to the UB Post newspaper the GIA acknowledged they had been asked by the Civil Aviation Authority of Mongolia (CAA) to test security without alerting any other party of the exercise.
You can see the original story on the UB Post’s website here
Can you believe these guys? Is the ignorance, arrogance, naivety or a general combination of all three? This just goes to show how little contact with the outside world Mongolian officials still have. Luckily for the GIA and CAA there was only apparently one foreigner on the plane, a Japanese national. Imagine the scene if there had been a group of American, British, or Israeli tourists on the flight who were familiar with stories of hijacking via the global media. They may have thought it worth taking matters into their own hands. The Americans would at least have attempted to sue the shit out of the CAA for setting up such a stupid stunt and causing mental trauma – and for once I’d be inclined to support the mentally traumatised party.
A MIAT flight from Dalanzadgad to UB was apparently held up by 2 passengers who pulled out pistols upon landing at UB airport last week. Some people were tied up but it all ended peacefully, the only casualties being a lady who received cuts on her face and lips and one person who was taken to hospital due to high blood pressure.
Unbeknownst to the passengers or flight crew this was a planned test of counter-terrorism measures with the “hijackers” being members of the Mongolian General Intelligence Agency (GIA). According to the UB Post newspaper the GIA acknowledged they had been asked by the Civil Aviation Authority of Mongolia (CAA) to test security without alerting any other party of the exercise.
You can see the original story on the UB Post’s website here
Can you believe these guys? Is the ignorance, arrogance, naivety or a general combination of all three? This just goes to show how little contact with the outside world Mongolian officials still have. Luckily for the GIA and CAA there was only apparently one foreigner on the plane, a Japanese national. Imagine the scene if there had been a group of American, British, or Israeli tourists on the flight who were familiar with stories of hijacking via the global media. They may have thought it worth taking matters into their own hands. The Americans would at least have attempted to sue the shit out of the CAA for setting up such a stupid stunt and causing mental trauma – and for once I’d be inclined to support the mentally traumatised party.
Sunday, December 03, 2006
Mongolian jeep trip fuel use - a random post...
Russian jeeps and vans - fuel use.
Just reading some posts on another travel website and it seems people are getting ripped-off with buying petrol on their jeep trips...
Russian vans and jeeps if well maintained should both average around 15 L / 100 km on a long jeep trip when mixing driving on asphalt, flat dirt-tracks and rugged areas. Thats 1 L of fuel for 6.6 km on average - use will be more in rugged areas but balanced by better efficiency in flat areas (or when the driver turns the engine off and coasts downhill...). Surprisingly I've logged almost identical fuel use in Toyota Landcruisers in Mongolia (4.6 L diesel engines).
Drivers can easily fool you with how much fuel they are using as both the vans and jeeps have 2 fuel tanks and the fuel gauges rarely work. If you are paying for the gas ask your driver fill up both tanks to full when you are leaving town. Then, allways fill up both tanks every time you refuel and keep a tally of the number of litres and the kilometres on the odometer (but the latter can be out by up to 10% if the jeep/van has non-factory wheels/tyres).
Random point of interest:
Russian jeeps have 2 fuel tanks of 39 L each
Russian vans have a 56 L main tank and a 30 L sub-tank
A loaded Zyl truck uses 65 L / 100 km...
Just reading some posts on another travel website and it seems people are getting ripped-off with buying petrol on their jeep trips...
Russian vans and jeeps if well maintained should both average around 15 L / 100 km on a long jeep trip when mixing driving on asphalt, flat dirt-tracks and rugged areas. Thats 1 L of fuel for 6.6 km on average - use will be more in rugged areas but balanced by better efficiency in flat areas (or when the driver turns the engine off and coasts downhill...). Surprisingly I've logged almost identical fuel use in Toyota Landcruisers in Mongolia (4.6 L diesel engines).
Drivers can easily fool you with how much fuel they are using as both the vans and jeeps have 2 fuel tanks and the fuel gauges rarely work. If you are paying for the gas ask your driver fill up both tanks to full when you are leaving town. Then, allways fill up both tanks every time you refuel and keep a tally of the number of litres and the kilometres on the odometer (but the latter can be out by up to 10% if the jeep/van has non-factory wheels/tyres).
Random point of interest:
Russian jeeps have 2 fuel tanks of 39 L each
Russian vans have a 56 L main tank and a 30 L sub-tank
A loaded Zyl truck uses 65 L / 100 km...
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)
